Aero 50 - First Build

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benji
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by benji »

Fuel petcock test:
Disconnect both lines from petcock to intake and carburetor. Take vacuum line from intake and try to "suck" on it (I know,I know) fuel should start to trickle out the other side. If it doesn't you gotta drain the tank and clean out the petcock (or buy a new one).

Spark test:
Take your plug out and hook it up to the plug wire, and hold the spark plugs side to the negative pole on the battery, or KNOWN good ground point. It should create a little spark when you hit the starter.

If both of those things happen, you need to clean your carb more in-depthly, or just buy a new one from ebay.
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benji
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by benji »

Spend like $30-40 tho, the cheaper ebay carbs suck n don't work really
mandalore
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

Meatball wrote:Have you checked to see if you have spark? How about if you have fuel flowing when vacuum is applied to vac line? If the spark plug's integrity is even in question it should be replaced with a new one. They are only like $3-$4 and can be bought anywhere. Cleaning the carb is not only a task that opens up potentially restricted ports but its also an exploratory mission as well. How did the rubber O-rings look? Float valve and valve seat? Emulsion tube? Gasket to intake? Any air leaks would cause it to not start so its important for everything to be sealed. Is your air/mixture screw set to factory spec? Sometimes after cleaning a carb, the screw is put back in the improper setting. Air filter..get a new one from Noiseguy...youre gonna need one anyway and his are top notch quality.....oh, and GO HAWKS!!!
Great advice, I didn't check for spark but I stopped in a hurry. it is the first thing Im gonna look at. Carb looked like it had been cleaned/opened before, gaskets and orings were decent. Vacuum lines didn't look great so I am getting new ones with other tune up parts. I need to find air mixture screw settings because I really doubt I put it back correctly.
benji wrote:Fuel petcock test:
Disconnect both lines from petcock to intake and carburetor. Take vacuum line from intake and try to "suck" on it (I know,I know) fuel should start to trickle out the other side. If it doesn't you gotta drain the tank and clean out the petcock (or buy a new one).

Spark test:
Take your plug out and hook it up to the plug wire, and hold the spark plugs side to the negative pole on the battery, or KNOWN good ground point. It should create a little spark when you hit the starter.

If both of those things happen, you need to clean your carb more in-depthly, or just buy a new one from ebay.
I was wondering about the petcock, never worked on one before I blew on one line and it was closed. I will test that out. I did drain the tank though, shook it up with clean gas in it and drained it a few times. Didn't see any debris.

Any specific brands I can look for for a new carb? I shouldn't upgrade the carb if everything else is stock though, correct?
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by kjkenney »

Nice score! If you haven't already downloaded it, here's a link to the service manual. Like benji said, stay away from the cheap carbs but I would stick with the stock keihin personally. Save those bucks for a seat cover or something :) It took me some elbow grease to get the gunk out of my 87 carb, but it has worked flawlessly for months now that it is. While the gas tank may seem good too, I really like my online fuel filter. Can see the gas flow, and catches little miniscule crap that can clog the carbs miniscule jets.
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benji
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by benji »

Ya I run an inline filter too just cuz... makes it so I can see if there's gas flow. If you don't plan on upgrading the stock motor, then just buy a small bucket and some seafoam (or berrymans,or your favorite carb cleaner) and strip down the carb as per the service manual and let all the parts soak for a few days, then don protective eyewear and blow out the carb w compressed air. Should work great after that.

If you DO plan on upgrading (and you will eventually) Then start upgrading. I think sss has an adapter for a polini cp carb to the oem manifold, and also an adapter to do a big-valve style intake (like what I got), but you should be able to get the oem one to work for now. They don't really break haha just get clogged up.

Also, check the reeds out to see if there cracked or chipped. That may need replacement.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by benji »

http://motorscooterguide.net/Downloads/Downloads.html
Link to a page w the service manual
http://www.racingplanetusa.com/honda-vi ... 035-1.html
Link to the racing planet page for parts for the European version. Most of this stuff fits.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

Well back at it, I guess I am just a fair weather scooter enthusiast for now...beautiful Saturday in Tacoma so I busted the Aero out of the shed today.

I got it to start for a second when I had it in my basement (killed it instantly as I was indoors) for the winter but haven't been able to replicate that, I am hoping my carb adjustments are just way off (non existent). I did this just because I put in a battery (didn't come with one)....

Today I:

1. Cleaned tank again
2. New air filter
3. Replaced petcock (I did suck on the old one and there was vacuum but it was cheap so I replaced. I see some mention of a screen between the petcock and the tank? I didn't see anything visible.
4. When I hold the plug on the coil to a good ground I see faint spark.
5. Clear fuel feed and return lines. I see fuel sitting in the feed line. None getting to the return that I can see.
6. Nothing is coming out of the carb drain screw when I removed it (the lower most screw)
7. I did baseline adjustments for idle screw and air mix I found on WikiSpreedia hoping this are for the AF05e?

Sounds like from everyones advice I didn't do a good job on cleaning the carb, or maybe put it back together wrong? I will go attempt that again after getting a newer Autolite spark plug and carb cleaner from AutoZone now.... I am free tomorrow too so I hope to get some progress!

Side note: As you can see I am fine spending a little cash making this thing newer and better. I searched for carbs but honestly couldn't even begin to pick one. It would be nice to buy a cool one without the giant honking air filter behind and get get a pod style.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

Also want to add that this is the only forum I've ever been on that I've gotten more replies than I have posted...Thanks everyone this is a really cool community!
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by Meatball »

mandalore wrote: 5. Clear fuel feed and return lines. I see fuel sitting in the feed line. None getting to the return that I can see.
6. Nothing is coming out of the carb drain screw when I removed it (the lower most screw)
.
If nothing is coming out of the drain screw after multiple start attempts...your carb isnt getting fuel.

The two lines coming from your petcock: one is the fuel line, other is a vacuum line that opens the petcock and allows fuel to flow. There should never be fuel in the vacuum line so it being dry is proper.

Test the petcock by disconnecting both lines from the carb, leaving the other ends attached to the petcock. If the petcock is working properly, fuel should not flow from the fuel line. Insert the fuel line into a bottle or catch can and suck on the vacuum line... this opens the petcock and now fuel should flow from the fuel line.

If your petcock is working fine, its possible your carb's fuel inlet is plugged. If its not plugged, its possible your reeds are stuck and not creating the required vacuum pressure to operate the petcock for fuel flow.
I need to find some new haters...the ones I have are starting to like me.
mandalore
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

Meatball wrote:
mandalore wrote: 5. Clear fuel feed and return lines. I see fuel sitting in the feed line. None getting to the return that I can see.
6. Nothing is coming out of the carb drain screw when I removed it (the lower most screw)
.
If nothing is coming out of the drain screw after multiple start attempts...your carb isnt getting fuel.

The two lines coming from your petcock: one is the fuel line, other is a vacuum line that opens the petcock and allows fuel to flow. There should never be fuel in the vacuum line so it being dry is proper.

Test the petcock by disconnecting both lines from the carb, leaving the other ends attached to the petcock. If the petcock is working properly, fuel should not flow from the fuel line. Insert the fuel line into a bottle or catch can and suck on the vacuum line... this opens the petcock and now fuel should flow from the fuel line.

If your petcock is working fine, its possible your carb's fuel inlet is plugged. If its not plugged, its possible your reeds are stuck and not creating the required vacuum pressure to operate the petcock for fuel flow.

I did confirm using your advice that when I suck on the vacuum the fuel line does indeed flow....so there is a carb problem.

I think the pilot may be clogged. I was trying to aim my compressor in there to blow air but couldn't get a good angle. I will buy some narrow wire tomorrow and try that...I think the rubber o-ring gaskets look pretty warped so I will look for a rebuild kit as well.

When I put fuel down the spark plug hole it does fire, but revs sky high instantly and the wheel spins like crazy, so I instantly kill it. It does seem to have good compression I tried to hold my thumb over the spark plug hole while cranking and the pressure knocked my finger away.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by Meatball »

Check to see if the carb slide is in backwards. This would cause high revvs.

Cleaning the carb sometimes takes a couple tries. The varnish that builds up over time is like dried tree sap and can be stubborn...even when using good carb cleaner. While youre in there, make sure your float and float needle are functioning properly. Make sure the tiny spring loaded pin on the float needle isnt stuck when pressed.

Another good way to tell if youre getting fuel to the combustion chamber is checking to see if the spark plug is wet after a few failed start attempts. Be sure its wiped off nice and dry before you start so results are obvious. If its getting fuel and not firing, that baby should be soaked.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

Meatball wrote:Check to see if the carb slide is in backwards. This would cause high revvs.

shows what I know. I didn't even know it could go in backwards. I will verify.

Cleaning the carb sometimes takes a couple tries. The varnish that builds up over time is like dried tree sap and can be stubborn...even when using good carb cleaner. While youre in there, make sure your float and float needle are functioning properly. Make sure the tiny spring loaded pin on the float needle isnt stuck when pressed.

Well what I think is a proper functioning needle is not a good meter of success. I will look on the wiki. It seems to move easily when I lightly touch the float and comes back.

Another good way to tell if youre getting fuel to the combustion chamber is checking to see if the spark plug is wet after a few failed start attempts. Be sure its wiped off nice and dry before you start so results are obvious. If its getting fuel and not firing, that baby should be soaked.

Will do, I bet it's going to be dry.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

I got a decent looking carb for about $24 shipped on eBay.

It has one extra nipple, same size as the smaller vacuum line coming off the intake manifold.

The original came with a plastic "spacer" between the manifold and the carb, the design of the new carb would need longer bolts so I will look for those. Is the plastic spacer necessary?
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by mandalore »

Took the manifold off, the front reed wasn't seating right.... broke the platic valve taking it apart

Can I fit an Elite reed valve? A quick search didn't result in a ehole valve, just Dio reeds.
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Re: Aero 50 - First Build

Post by jakubman1 »

I got them elite reeds !
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