Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

This is the place to discuss your build with other builders and solicit feedback and help with parts of your build: engine, body work, bolt ons, etc.

Moderator: Moderator

Post Reply
Revolutionary
Spree
Spree
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:25 pm
Location: Colleyville, TX

Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Revolutionary »

I posted some questions on the Performance section and have gotten some great advice. Figured it was time to post up what this project is.

Bonneville Salt Flats SCTA land speed record for a <50cc motorcycle with sidecar is 62.587mph. I figure there is no reason that cannot be beat. I have raced at Bonneville for a few years with my car, but as that is under the knife for a major change (300mph plans) I need to have something to keep my hands busy on the weekends. I know this will not be easy, but nothing good ever is.

The general plan:

Power mods - minor port work, better reeds, new intake and carb, exhausts system, taller gears

chassis mods - 5" stretch (50" wheelbase minimum per rules), lower by 2", build sidecar, remove all plastic panels and make more aero with less frontal area, taller tires

I will post up some pics and points to ponder as it progresses. I look forward to receiving any good input as I have never built a performance 2 stroke scooter before. Many years owning a performance automotive machine shop, but always avoided 2 stroke stuff. New learning experience for me.
Revolutionary
Spree
Spree
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:25 pm
Location: Colleyville, TX

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Revolutionary »

Sidecar 'seating area' is required to be a minimum 12" x 32". I have a ladder frame with aluminum diamond plate to cover it and a support structure that I have a good start on.

Image
Revolutionary
Spree
Spree
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:25 pm
Location: Colleyville, TX

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Revolutionary »

made a 5 inch stretch motor mount and relocated the shock mount back and 1 inch up to lower the rear.

Image

Image
User avatar
ped
CB900F
CB900F
Posts: 1783
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:54 pm
Location: northeast usa

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by ped »

HI REV. take a look at cruzingratiot post. 2000 Mystic Purple Elite build (70.1 mph)

Red Eft Performance. check out post, Malossi,Polini,Anything Updated 7-10-13 and Red Eft Performance presents Fabrizi Couple more pics *

graphite9 check out post, Scorpion, arrow, burial pipes, center stands, oko's-n-more
these guys can help. GL

if you can get the Honda elite sa50 94-01 AF16 motor you may have more performance options. :imo:
but you can make anything work. try to keep the weight down on the side car. that will help big time. weigh everything. diamond plate, sheet metal, screen, use the light weight you can. that little motor got to work hard. good luck . keep us posted with photos :thumbwink:
Life's a trip enjoy the ride.
94 elite SR, 86 spreedio, polini corsa, keli variator, 8.4, jet. speed 65 mph
spreedio video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZr46_-douQ
User avatar
ped
CB900F
CB900F
Posts: 1783
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:54 pm
Location: northeast usa

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by ped »

Revolutionary wrote:Sidecar 'seating area' is required to be a minimum 12" x 32". I have a ladder frame with aluminum diamond plate to cover it and a support structure that I have a good start on.

Image
hi rev. that latter frame look a little heavy? if you don't have to ride someone on sidecar make it a little lighter. nice work.
Life's a trip enjoy the ride.
94 elite SR, 86 spreedio, polini corsa, keli variator, 8.4, jet. speed 65 mph
spreedio video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZr46_-douQ
User avatar
Wheelman-111
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 11319
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Wheelman-111 »

Greetings:

I'm guessing the strut supporting the ladder frame isn't the only thing you plan for that purpose? Otherwise, even if the "sidecar" is never occupied, that outboard wheel will flap like a wounded chicken. It looks like it needs a lot more support in 3 planes. Another strut to the "L" in the frame ahead of the fuel tank and a third strut to the motor mount area would create a strong tetrahedron to locate that outboard wheel. If the material is aluminum, weight won't be such a problem as drag.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Revolutionary
Spree
Spree
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:25 pm
Location: Colleyville, TX

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Revolutionary »

There is a minimum weight on the sidecar that the third wheel must have 10% of total bike weight as sitting on the ground. So far it only weights less than 10 lbs though (steel). The wheel will weigh more than the structure.

It will end up with three support points on the frame - at bottom near motor mounts and adjacent to shock mount on the near side.
User avatar
LMH
Board Supporter
Board Supporter
Posts: 2096
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:00 pm
Location: usa

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by LMH »

.
Last edited by LMH on Tue Dec 30, 2014 11:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
ped
CB900F
CB900F
Posts: 1783
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 9:54 pm
Location: northeast usa

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by ped »

LoveMyHonda wrote:Gearing is going to be the first major hurdle with that engine. There's one choice anymore and it drops it to 7.58:1 which is good for top end but here comes the second hurdle, the power to get there. Those engines are a tad bit weaker than the later model 94-01. You will have a lot more options for exhaust and gears if you change to the later style engine also. You're going to need some good flow.
+1 I agree on the motor. 94-01 elite sa50 AF16 has more gearing and options. you can still use that motor mount with AF16 motor. but, the bolt is to thin you'll have to add spacers on the motor mount bolt. just use the steel dowel pins on kick start cover. if you go with the AF16 motor and that mount.
Life's a trip enjoy the ride.
94 elite SR, 86 spreedio, polini corsa, keli variator, 8.4, jet. speed 65 mph
spreedio video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZr46_-douQ
Revolutionary
Spree
Spree
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:25 pm
Location: Colleyville, TX

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Revolutionary »

Sounds like I will be looking for an AF16 but for the time being, most everything I have will swap over. I'll keep on keeping on to get everything up and running then put the new bullet in.

received an OKO 24 and manifold yesterday. Had to make an adaptor to seal it to the block, but otherwise no probs. Now searching the forum for the best throttle cable solution. Looks like this may work http://www.ebay.com/itm/161213881122


Image
User avatar
LMH
Board Supporter
Board Supporter
Posts: 2096
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:00 pm
Location: usa

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by LMH »

.
Last edited by LMH on Tue Dec 30, 2014 11:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
curtis966
Elite
Elite
Posts: 833
Joined: Sat May 26, 2012 10:52 pm
Location: michigan

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by curtis966 »

I ran a 21mm oko on my stock af05 bore before my bbk came in the mail. I had the exhaust port ported and I smoothed out all the casting errors around all the other ports with a fresh hone. It was really nice down low and had a lot better throttle response than the stock carb. Only had it for 2 days so not much more to report lol.
86 Aero 50,Polini 65cc BBK,malossi oring head,100 oct. 32:1
21mm OKO,Malossi Wild Lion exhaust,
Stock Ruck vari, malossi special belt,1.5k shoes,1k center,
aftermarket bell, front/rear metro wheels, TT vapor,
5in stretch on motor mount,280mm Shock.
Pineapplegti
Elite
Elite
Posts: 654
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:43 pm
Location: Las Vegas Nv

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Pineapplegti »

I know they don't run very well with a 28 on a stick af16 lol..not enough vacuum to pull a decent signal through the carb..had to upjet like crazy plus add a restrictor to get out to run
78 Kromag. (Briton Bee) .. Under the knife.. Derbi pyramid port dual variated
78 flying dutchman.. e50 swap. mlm pipe custom tank seat.. gila kit
85 Honda spree . Af16 swap joerock mhr mini stroke scorpion pipe.
Revolutionary
Spree
Spree
Posts: 101
Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:25 pm
Location: Colleyville, TX

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by Revolutionary »

Slowly making some progress here. I have the frame built and the wheel mounted with adjustable toe for dialing it in. Final wheelbase is 50.5" and track wide is 32.5"

Image

Image
User avatar
deuce217
CB900F
CB900F
Posts: 1212
Joined: Thu Jun 10, 2010 4:13 am

Re: Sidecar Bonneville Land Speed Elite 50 build

Post by deuce217 »

Sweet! Nice fab work.
2000 Elite SR50 -THE PURPLE NURPLE
50mm BBK (tai)
26mm OKO (round slide) 135 Main Jet
V-8 pipe
39/18 secondary gears (7.583:1 ratio)
36 grams in Prodigy variator
Malossi Delta Clutch & WIng Bell- Thanks RED EFT
65mph GPS (on the freeway)
Post Reply