Lost some top speed

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 11:14 am

Hi All,

I'm sure this has nothing to do with it but... I switched 2 stoke oil from Havoline to Klotz full synthetic. It seems since doing this the scooter is a little more sluggish on the take-off and a couple of MPH slower on top end. I'm not sure if the muffler may be clogged, it looks like it has a nice exhaust color coming out. I live in a condo complex that is pretty restricted so before I pis# anybody at the complex off is there a way to verify it may be clogged? Can I loosen the bolts to the exhaust and back it away from the head and try it that way? I sure it will be loud, but I will do it at a different location. It had a new top end about 4 months ago, compression was very good at that time. Have not checked it since.

Any other thoughts?

Thanks

motormike · Post by **motormike** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:26 pm

No, do not attempt to diagnose by removing the pipe or loosening it.
The engine will not perform without the pipe and you risk damaging the cylinder by running lean....

First, take a look inside the CVT cover and see if the belt has worn by measuring the spine for width and comparing to minimum specs.

Secondly, inspect the roller weights for wear/flat spots.

Changing oils would not affect speed...

bonesv · Post by **bonesv** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 3:48 pm

is it pre-mixed? what ratio oil to fuel? You can try cleaning the spark plug also.

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 4:55 pm

Maybe I should read my post before I submit them.

The scooter is a 1986 Spree totally stock. clean carb, new 68 main jet, 4 month old top end, cleaned and oiled air filter, fairly new spark plug. I also replaced the belt with a Gates 7250. The scooter was running sluggish prior to the belt change, it did have the correct Honda OEM belt not sure how old it was. When I posted the question regarding belt size it was said that a Gates 7250 would work, so I put one on. It didn't feel any different.

Motormike,

I will check the belt just to be sure. I will probably get a Honda OEM belt to rule that item out.

Since I didn't mention it was a spree the roller weights were a good place to start.

Thanks

Bonesv,

No it is not pre-mix, I am using the auto lube.

Thanks

bonesv · Post by **bonesv** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 5:01 pm

OK Thanks Bob. Did you check the Klotz label, is it pre-mix only? And, did you just pour into reservoir or drain first, then fill?

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Fri Jul 17, 2015 5:05 pm

It is Klotz KL-300, it say it is for oil injection. I did drained the tank prior to putting in the new oil.

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Mon Jul 20, 2015 7:39 am

Here is an update. Replaced the Gates 7250 with a gates 7240. The difference is the 7250 has an outside circumference of 25-5/8" (650mm), the 7240 has an outside circumference of 24-5/8" (624mm) and the OEM is 628mm. I took apart the driven pulley, cleaned and regreased. Removed and cleaned the carburetor. The scooter starts and idles fine. The belt helped with the top speed, it is now back to 28-30 mph. With the scooter on the center stand and running it through the revs, it boggs down when the throttle is first twisted but through the rest of the revs it sounds good. I tried another after market carb and it did the same thing. Not sure what else to look at. Any ideas?

patthesoundguy · Post by **patthesoundguy** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 7:32 am

If the carb is clean you need to set the idle air mixture and idle speed. If it's too lean at idle it will bog a little. It's a simple process. Double check the the carb air hose at the carb make sure the clamp is good.

1man8scoots · Post by **1man8scoots** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 8:08 am

If it bogs off idle it's too rich. If it revs slow and then picks up its lean.

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:25 pm

1man8scoots wrote:If it bogs off idle it's too rich. If it revs slow and then picks up its lean.

patthesoundguy wrote:If the carb is clean you need to set the idle air mixture and idle speed. If it's too lean at idle it will bog a little. It's a simple process. Double check the the carb air hose at the carb make sure the clamp is good.

Not sure I understand the two recommendations. They look like they contradict each other. I will try to adjust the air screw.

I know this should not make a difference and maybe it is just a coincidence, but talking with the wife, this all seemed to start when I started using the Klotz 2 stroke oil. Is there a way to clean out old oil residue in the engine? Seafoam? If so how would you do it?

Thanks

Wheelman-111 · Post by **Wheelman-111** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 8:58 pm

Greetings:

Bad oil is unlikely to be your cause, but if you're worried and want to switch brands, the new stuff will eventually wash away the old. Change your spark plug, and whatever you do, DON'T try to flush the cases with any type of solvent, Sea Foam or Stabil.

patthesoundguy · Post by **patthesoundguy** » Fri Jul 24, 2015 4:28 pm

You can have a bogging issue if it's too lean or too rich. I find it has to be extremely rich to get a bog off of idle if its too rich. I also agree with wheelman, the oil is unlikely to be your problem. The first step is to set the idle air mixture and go from there. You could have a worn cylinder which can cause a kind of bogging issue then will be fine once it revs up. And if the belt is any wider than the stock one it will have a different gear ratio from stock which make the gearing feel like its starting in a higher gear so to speak than before. Like 2nd instead of first gear on a manual transmission. That will manifest in a bottom end bog because it takes more torque to get moving from a stop

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:33 am

Next Update:

I have been adjusting the air bleed screw up and down a little bit at a time and it still is dangerously slow on take-off, it helps to push off when you turn the throttle. If you put the scooter on the center stand and with it warm, when you rev it up it does not sound like a two stroke would. does not hit high rpms fast. Once the scooter is moving 10mph, it takes right off, is very responsive and tops out at 29-31mph according to the speedometer. Does this sound like the exhaust may be plug? Is there a way to determine if the exhaust is plugged?

Any more thoughts? This is driving me crazy, not sure what to look at next. Hate to take it to a local shop.

Thanks

swimmingfree · Post by **swimmingfree** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:57 am

the pipe is ezey to clean just bill a fire and throw it in ..then let it cool and paint it ...
swimmingfree

btosi · Post by **btosi** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 12:40 pm

Next Update:

Have not done a compression check, will do that tomorrow.

Drained out the premium fuel and replaced with regular. Fiddled around with the air bleed screw. Took for a test ride no change. During the test ride I did notice one thing. Now I am not a big guy, 140lbs, but sitting on the seat with both feet on the ground, throttle wide open and with very little effort I can hold the scooter from moving. The engine boggs down, very little rpms. I assume since it is not revving up the clutch is not slipping.

I will add that the top speed is back up to 28-30 mph according to the speedometer. The take off is painfully slow.

I am thinking the compression test will show low compression.

Does anybody know if chopchop still sells stock bore top end kits? I can not find them on eBay any more. And before you mention a BBK , had one on it last year and removed it this past March, the wife did not like that she had to add additional oil to the gas.

Thanks

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