Keeping Cool With Mods: Jetting and ?? Fan Options?

[toboggan]

Hey, no problem! anytime!

[z50r-ghost]

there ARE actual high(er) performance or "racing"fans that are made for the AF05 engine, AF16, etc.
-i know because i have one!!

Anyone here ever heard of the Japanese motorcycle-performance parts manufacturer called DAYTONA?
*Daytona's quality is literally equal to OEM Honda parts.* -i have used Daytona parts on my JDM Honda Monkey bike builds for the past 15 years, and have never had any quality issues; and they are quite proud in saying "all the parts they mfg are designed, produced, and r&d 'd by them..." Daytona's downside? Their stuff is EXPENSIVE!!

Anyways, i bought a Koso fan thinking that it was an actual higher performing fan, but in comparing it to a stock Honda fan, it is identical - the only difference is the blades on the Koso fan are reversed, which is the reason for the "whistle."
-i never knew they exploded, though!!

-i bought a Daytona fan for my AF16, which Daytona claims is rigid to 10,000+ rpm, allows for noticeably less drag (lighter weight), and flows something like 40% more air over the stock fan. Also, it's red! it looks like it's made of a Delrin-like plastic. -when i installed it i cut out the "louvers" in the stock fan shroud which should add some more efficiency as well.

will my motor ever see 10,000+ ? hopefully not, or the least of my worries will be my fan exploding....

later, jc

[808BMW]

I think the reason for the reverse direction (other than the whistle) is that air will be pulled out of the fan (instead of in) reversing the flow of hot air from back towards the wheel to going out of the fan cover.

Daytona makes red + blue fans. Daytona is high quality stuff, but I don't rank anything as "OEM quality" unless it really is OEM.

[Lunytune]

I think the reason for the reverse direction (other than the whistle) is that air will be pulled out of the fan (instead of in) reversing the flow of hot air from back towards the wheel to going out of the fan cover.

I'm sure the direct air toward the wheel would be less objectionable to whoever may feel that air on the side if reversed, but which is more effective for cooling the engine?

[toboggan]

Link to the daytona fan?

[Arnadanoob]

there ARE actual high(er) performance or "racing"fans that are made for the AF05 engine, AF16, etc.
-i know because i have one!!

Be careful of what you buy, a lot of us have been turning wrenches on Honda (and their clones) mopeds for over 15 years and we have yet to find one better than stock. The OEM Honda DIO fan is lightweight and works really well, the only other one I've found to perform a little better is the Taiwan SYM fan and shroud, the fan itself is larger with a larger surface area and it appears to be more rigid. The temp difference between both on race prepped engines that spin 11-13k is about 25F on average. The stock OEM fan is good to the limits of what a DIO engine can realitically rev to. The guys in the Philippines that drag race DIOs... none of them use anything but a stock OEM fan, unless it's water cooled. Besides, on aftermarket carb setups, a slight turn of the air screw will net a larger cooling effect than a fan change.

Daytona is a good Japanese company that makes pretty good stuff and at one time in history they were ahead in the game. Their variators are second rate compared to the Keli, their Daytona 2 ramp plate isn't as good as the SEF 2 ramp plates (which is a copy of the Daytona). Their roller weights and torque springs are second to none as I believe they're the best at the moment. Their racing CDI is rubbish. Daytona stopped developing parts for a very long time (over 10 years) so naturally they're behind the times. Saying that Daytona is good is like telling someone with a DIO now that the best setup is with a Polini 70cc kit, with Polini reed cage and reeds, Polini chamber pipe, and polini trans. A DIO with Taiwan parts using less than half the amount of cash will smoke the full Polini setup now.

I'd be happy to suggest parts that provide the best bang of the buck as needed. It's unfortunate that a lot of the best parts in history are no longer being made.

[808BMW]

I'm sure the direct air toward the wheel would be less objectionable to whoever may feel that air on the side if reversed, but which is more effective for cooling the engine?

In the fan + out the back is the best, that's why Honda did it. Stick to stock.

It's unfortunate that a lot of the best parts in history are no longer being made.

So horribly true. What's the deal with SEF? I hear so many different stories, do they still make parts? Is everything NOS?

I want a real SEF magic, or an arrow

[Arnadanoob]

SEF makes accessories now, not major components. The SEF Majik is an incredible pipe, we've made some 72cc motors with radical porting that put many strokers away. The SEF Black is my favorite all purpose pipe, more so than the PG Long since it's incredibly quiet and the power potential (when tuned right) matches an unaltered PG Long. The Arrow chamber pipe is perhaps one of the best 72cc pipes in history, the power range on that pipe was phenomenal but all are no longer being made.

However... PG has their unmarked pipes that combine the PG Long design with the properties of the SEF Majik and we're testing them right now and I have to say that it's quite shocking how good they are. They respond well to basic tuning and they flow incredibly well at higher rpms that'll snap a normal crank. I've been testing this new pipe on my spare 72cc Malossi bike with street porting using a full circle crank with a 28mm carb but I think I need to go smaller to a 24mm to go faster and scrap the CT mani in favor of a KRS mani, I could stay with the 28mm and switch out to my other Malossi bore with race porting but it won't last very long on the street with heavy piston and ring wear. I have a contact in the P.I. for a Plasma Racing CDI which should help dial in the power better to the pipe.

[808BMW]

Unmarked pipes? Do they sell them?
I heard guys saying to cut out the baffles from a PG long and weld them into a SEF majik, I just figured that is tweak status

[Arnadanoob]

Check your PM 808.

[toboggan]

Link for these new pg longs?

[Arnadanoob]

It's not a PG Long. It doesn't carry the PG badge on them and from what I understand there's no link to them since they're still in the experimental stage. If your bike isn't at least a very built 72cc, stay away from them for now. I've already had to deal with 1 hard headed customer who insisted that he could make it work on his 72cc only to find his motor doesn't make enough power to benefit from this pipe without major modifications.

[Lunytune]

A DIO with Taiwan parts using less than half the amount of cash will smoke the full Polini setup now.

I sure hope you're right on that, as USPS should be delivering my Taiwan kit today for my Elite Dio. Tazland advertises it as a 50mm, which he calls a 3 over? I'm confused on that, as I thought the stock AF16 bore was 39mm. BTW, I also ordered a metric caliper from Harbor Freight. It's time to get real about measuring instead of converting metric/inch.

[808BMW]

He is referring to 3 over his typical 47mm setups.

Small quirk: Bore comes with head studs, but no nuts. You can re-use your head bolts, but I prefer studs and had extra nuts.

[Lunytune]

He is referring to 3 over his typical 47mm setups.

Small quirk: Bore comes with head studs, but no nuts. You can re-use your head bolts, but I prefer studs and had extra nuts.

Yeah, I noticed th studs minus nuts when I opened the package this evening. I had every intention on standing on the porch waiting for the mailman, and installing it today, but my SIL sidetracked me into hauling hay today, and tomorrow a 4th picnic on the 3rd (wife works on the 4th), so it looks like it will be Saturday before I get to it.

So then, if stock is 39, his 50 is really an 11mm over stock, and 3mm over competition's 47mm kits. That's a pretty big jump. He sent a 100 jet, but I wonder if it will take more than that to appreciate full potential, such as larger carb.