87 elite speed issues

mcd · Post by **mcd** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:03 pm

Hello all, done some reading on the boards and figured I would post this to try and find an answer. I have just purchased an 87 elite, and I believe it is an Iowa model. I could not find any documentation of VIN numbers (for elites), but I did notice that above the Honda sticker on the side panels, there is an Iowa stick (dead giveaway, huh).

My problem is that when I got my elite running (not running when I bought it), it only does about 20 mph. I checked the exhaust pipe, and there is no washer, like mentioned for the sprees. I also noticed that it runs best without the air cleaner and airbox lid.

My question is what are the differences between 49 state models and Iowa models, and how can I bypass the Iowa restrictions. I would also like to gain more top speed, so any other suggestions would be appreciated.

I had owned another 87 elite a few years ago, and it would do about 35 mph. I was not aware of any modifications that had been done to it, and it was not the Iowa model. Is this the normal top speed of an elite, and if so, how can I get there with my current elite?

Thanks in advance for the help, and I appreciate all the knowledge that is on your forums.

darat · Post by **darat** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 10:24 pm

ahh yes someone else with a 87. well u can do alot to it.. go to www.vtcycles.com they can help it out..

tonrogs · Post by **tonrogs** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:18 pm

Here is some VIN info....
http://www.jacksscootershop.com/honda_VIN.html

bitteraspects · Post by **bitteraspects** » Mon Apr 03, 2006 11:59 pm

woohoo more 87's

mcd · Post by **mcd** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:29 am

Yeah, I was surprised to find another 87, that was exactly like my old one (same color scheme and all). The only difference is this Iowa model delima. I went to that site with the VIN numbers, and all it tells me is that I have an 87. It does not differentiate between 49 state and Iowa models for that year. Any ideas on how to tell for certain?

Also, I am still semi in tune with some of the mods to this scoot. My main question is should I purchase an aftermarket hi speed pulley, or perform the back plate removal on my stock unit? Will the aftermarket part still net me 5+ mph over the modified unit? If they are close to the same, I would like to save the money (obviously). Thanks for the help.

bitteraspects · Post by **bitteraspects** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 12:38 am

heres where i chime in with my opinion of, "throw out that 87 motor, and do a dio transplant". thats what i did on my 87, as well as a bunch of other mods. but ill never have to worry about doing 20 thats for sure.

mcd · Post by **mcd** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 1:02 am

I realize that is probably the easiest way to go fast, but it will also cost me a good bit of money. I would be happy (for now) just to get this scoot up to about 35 mph, with as little money spent as possible. Thanks.

bitteraspects · Post by **bitteraspects** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 8:30 am

yeah true, it is quite an investment. but if youre willing to spend the cash to have a good motor, its the way to go. but i hear you about the saving cash thing

Post by **noiseguy** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:31 am

I'm not aware of an "Iowa" Elite scooter. Check the head badge and get back to us with a model number... or was there only one model Elite for this year (SB50 and SA50...?). The SA50 (or SE50?) should do 35 MPH with no problem. Dio swaps or kitting that engine can get you to 45-55 MPH.

20 MPH is too slow. Either your carb is goofed up or you have low compression. If you've already cleaned the carb, and are sure you did a good job, check the compression. Did you put in a new plug, BTW?

Also, check the carb serial number. The different Honda carbs are bolt-up interchangable, but are jetted differently.

mcd · Post by **mcd** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 7:47 pm

Ok, gave the scoot a good once over and here is what I found. Took the carb off and cleaned it again with no improvement. Bowl is very clean, and jets appear clean as well. Carb has 31kABC7 stamped on it. The last number (7) is a guess, because it looks more like a chinese symbol than anything.

Pulled the plug out again and inspected it. Appears to be in good condition, and the gap is 0.025". It is an NGK BP4HS plug.

Checked the compression, and it averages about 95 psi, with a max I saw of 100 psi. Is this normal, or maybe a little on the low side? It will reach 90 psi in about 4 kicks, and never gets any higher.

Next removed hi speed pulley and cleaned rollers/ramp. The rollers appear to be worn a little, and the ramp has marks on it from the rollers sliding, instead of rolling (my guess). I measured the belt width and it was 11mm. Seems like I read somewhere this should be 13mm? If so, that could be part of the problem.

Put everything back together and ran it with no improvement, still 20 mph. It will not run very well with the air box cover on, but when I remove the cover, and leave the filter in the box, it runs fairly well (not 100% by any means, but better).

For grins, I next removed the muffler and ran it for a short sprint. I noticed two things. One, it was incredibly loud (and I like loud pipes) and two it accelerated like a mad man. I got it up to right at 30 mph before I could not stand the noise anymore, but it was still pulling.

With all that, I believe that my muffler is either factory restricted, or clogged. All the other items appeared to be in good shape (except maybe the belt).

My question is should I fork over the $120+ for an aftermarket pipe, or attempt to clean mine out? If I clean it out, what is the most effective way to do so (besides the torch, dont have one and a little too dangerous for my tastes). Also, is there any truth to the Iowa elites existance? The only reason that leads me to believe I have one is that there are two Iowa stickers about the Honda on the side panels. At first I did not know what to make of it, but that seems to be a logical explanation.

As always, thanks again for the ongoing help, and hopefully I can get the scoot up to full speed soon. BTW 55 mph with a dio transplant! That sounds like it could be too much fun to pass up. Maybe in the near future!

MySpree · Post by **MySpree** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:46 pm

you cannot putr an aftermarket pipe on a stock 50cc head... its too big!

darat · Post by **darat** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 9:57 pm

well not all of us have the $$$ to buy a dio so that is out of the question..

bitteraspects · Post by **bitteraspects** » Tue Apr 04, 2006 10:55 pm

Indeed. I wish I had the money for a dio.

I have a set of iowa panels, with the 2 stickers onit, so its not just you. I can't remember what the difference was for the iowa speck mopeds off hand, ill have to ask the boss again, he was the one who explained it to me the first time.
A couple things come to mind for your bike. First, you should probably be running a much cooler plug in your bike. Possibly a bp9hs. I think that plug is too much for your stock motor.
Second. How bad are your weights? If they look flat on one side, you may want to replace it, it could be causing unneccesary strain on your transmition. And if you have a scale, make sure they're the right weight. (8.5g I believe) I'd also check your centerspring to see if its a little flat. Every little bit helps.
Also check your pully boss. Make sure there is no play on the boss when it sits in the pully. Try rocking it a little to se if it moves. If there's any play on it you might want to think about changing pullys.
And also as stated, don't bother with an aftermarket pipe if you have a stock setup. Your best bet may be to find a stock replacement. I see some on ebay once in a while.

Good luck

85stroka · Post by **85stroka** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 1:40 am

http://teamcalamari.com/ has liquid carbon remover that works wonders-you have to call though.
I ve used a lot of times and I love it becasue you dont need a torch ,just some hot water and plugs!

MySpree · Post by **MySpree** » Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:12 am

and if this gets on ur skin will it burn it off?