1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Trying to get your Spree/Elite to run, or run better? Post your questions here.

Moderator: Moderator

Post Reply
BobV
Noob
Noob
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:29 pm
Location: Michigan

1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by BobV »

I have two 1994 Elite SA50P, I bought them new in 1994 for kids, they rode them for about 10 years and then they sat in garage for about 10 years. Decided to get them running for grand kids to ride. Scooter1 I drained old gas from tank replaced with fresh gas, new spark plug, new air filter, new battery and new tire tubes. It fired up after about 8-10 kick/starts, been running fine since. Scooter2 different story, it had a dry gas tank, looking inside I could see daylight several rust holes, replaced gas tank and cap with new (oem), replaced same items as Scooter1. Scooter2 turned over but wouldnÔÇÖt start, checked spark appeared good replaced carb (ebay), it sputtered a little but wouldnÔÇÖt start, gave up till next spring. Now engine wouldnÔÇÖt turn over even with kick start, removed spark plug (installed new 6 months earlier) tip severely corroded. Pulled head, piston and cylinder walls rusted, removed cylinder and piston. Cleaned piston honed cylinder replaced piston rings, new gaskets and plug, it turns over much faster, still no start. Checked compression (80psi) low but I felt it should be enough to fire, has gas in float bowl of carb, checked spark again seems ok. Replaced pulse reed valve, no change, it wonÔÇÖt even pop or sputter. Tried squirting gas/oil mix in through spark plug still no pop or sputter. I coming back to the compression level would this cause it to not even try to start? Any comments or suggestions are
appreciated. Thanks.
User avatar
burnt_toast
Veteran OG
Veteran OG
Posts: 3591
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: 1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by burnt_toast »

Yes 80psi is too low to start. 100-110min in general, manual calls for 114min

see manual for service limit: section 3-7 (page 27)
http://www.hondaspree.net/other/SA50_88-02_service.pdf

the "turns over much faster now" part makes me think, something's not sealing right at piston/cyl. how much did you hone? and replace with stock rings? possible they are no longer within clearance.

bandaid solution to try is remove headgasket, and see if that gets your more compression, enough to start. but def won't be the correct fix to whatever root problem is there.
projects galore :nerd:
User avatar
Meatball
CB900F
CB900F
Posts: 2320
Joined: Sat Jun 04, 2016 10:45 am
Location: seattle

Re: 1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by Meatball »

Gas tank rusted all the way through? Corrosion/rust on spark plug and cylinder walls? Was this thing at the bottom of a swamp?!? I bet the crank seals are toast if the rest was that bad. You'll never get crankcase pressure if those are failing...
I need to find some new haters...the ones I have are starting to like me.
kevinv710
Spree
Spree
Posts: 243
Joined: Fri Jul 12, 2013 2:03 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: 1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by kevinv710 »

for me...just new hone and rings 80 psi is ok, because they have not broken-in yet, 80psi is not enough minimum performance requirement, but to start an engine, yes it could be.....i would pay attention to ignition spark and gas supply in cold start (in warm weather).......on ignition spark make sure ignition system having a great ground connections, so you could have best spark and continuously........on gas supplier, you can have the carb installed without airfilter boot connected so you can use your fingers to help your carb in case of electric choke not working.........do the same procedure as testing compression but use your thumb to cover spark plug hole instead, it should push out your thumb when you kick start it, at the same time it refresh any over gas/oil left in there.....last step, remove exhaust, long time parked bike getting pipe clogged up by oil/water all the time, you can start your engine without exhaust installed...with those steps gone thru, the engine must fire ups.
Happy Father's Day, Gentlemen!
Best Regards!
Kev
User avatar
burnt_toast
Veteran OG
Veteran OG
Posts: 3591
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: 1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by burnt_toast »

kevinv710 wrote:for me...just new hone and rings 80 psi is ok, because they have not broken-in yet, 80psi is not enough minimum performance requirement, but to start an engine, yes it could be.....i would pay attention to ignition spark and gas supply in cold start (in warm weather).......on ignition spark make sure ignition system having a great ground connections, so you could have best spark and continuously........on gas supplier, you can have the carb installed without airfilter boot connected so you can use your fingers to help your carb in case of electric choke not working.........do the same procedure as testing compression but use your thumb to cover spark plug hole instead, it should push out your thumb when you kick start it, at the same time it refresh any over gas/oil left in there.....last step, remove exhaust, long time parked bike getting pipe clogged up by oil/water all the time, you can start your engine without exhaust installed...with those steps gone thru, the engine must fire ups.
Happy Father's Day, Gentlemen!
Best Regards!
Kev
well put Kevin. good point about the exhaust possibly being plugged up

any luck Bob?
projects galore :nerd:
BobV
Noob
Noob
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Jun 13, 2017 2:29 pm
Location: Michigan

Re: 1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by BobV »

Thanks for responses, I removed the muffler no change, I checked compression again it's lower 53psi. Ordered the Honda oversized piston and rings (0.5mm). Going to take cylinder and new piston to machine shop to get them
sized properly, it's got to be compression. Will update when that's done.
User avatar
motormike
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5488
Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2010 10:58 pm
Location: Glasgow, KY

Re: 1994 Honda Elite SA50P won't start

Post by motormike »

*
Attachments
Thumbs up.jpg
Thumbs up.jpg (17.56 KiB) Viewed 5404 times
RideRed
<Gyro S><MB5><Honda Navi><Helix><Sym Wolf><Yamaha Razz><Honda CH150 Deluxe>
"Live Large - Ride Small"
Post Reply