Orange spark?? Thats not right. . . is it?

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 3:59 pm

So I mentioned that my scooter had good spark. But I just read that it should be blue. My spark is orange.

Thats bad, right? Can anyone tell me what might cause this? Will it contribute to my scooter not starting?

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:10 pm

no, thats just so-so spark.

Blue/white= "Great Spark"
red/yellow= "it has spark"
nothing = "no spark"

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:11 pm

orange is still spark, its better then nothing. you should be able to get your bike to start with orange.

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:09 pm

hmmm. . . . well im stumped

Kenny_McCormic · Post by **Kenny_McCormic** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 5:11 pm

New plug time.

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:11 pm

I JUST added a new plug a minute ago. Someone suggested I try to kickstart it a few times, remove the plug and see if its wet with gas. Sure enough, it wasn't. So I guess its a fuel problem?

I suppose I just start with the fuel * and move forward from there?

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:17 pm

did you try the 2 stroke oil trick?

taking out the plug, putting about a cap of 2 stroke in the spark plug hole, kicking it a few times, then putting the plug back in? This is the "compression" test.
If the motor starts up, that means your motor needs the top end rebuilt. If the motor doesn't start then you have problems with the fuel system.

Try that out and see what happens.

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 6:46 pm

Dac wrote:did you try the 2 stroke oil trick?

taking out the plug, putting about a cap of 2 stroke in the spark plug hole, kicking it a few times, then putting the plug back in? This is the "compression" test.
If the motor starts up, that means your motor needs the top end rebuilt. If the motor doesn't start then you have problems with the fuel system.

Try that out and see what happens.

Tried it. It started. So when it started, it ran at high idle for around 5 seconds then die. Didnt sputter, just quit. Lots of smoke.

Top end is gone? Please dont say yes! LOL. Does anyone have any ideas? Is there anything I can ad to the oil or gas so I can use it untill I can do a rebuild?

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:07 pm

hate to break the bad news, but if it starts up after adding the oil it means it needs work to the top end.

What needs to be done is you need to remove all the rear panels and seat pan so you can get to the motor. Then remove the fan shrouds off and the exhaust.
Then remove the 4 head bolts, remove the head. Then remove the cylinder. Then remove the clips and the pin from the piston and take that off too.

Now you have to look over everything and decide what you need. most common i have seen is...
A- the rings are wore out, since they are not working your motor has no compression.
B- The rings broke, fell apart and left groves in your cylinder and piston.
I believe you can still get pistons and rings from honda. Most of the time you can hone your cylinder and reuse that. Then just get a new piston and rings from honda. Along with new gaskets and clips.

Like i said before, i believe the Pal has the same top end as a spree. might want to double check with keithw. So getting parts shouldn't be to hard.

There is no way to really prolong the life of a bad cylinder. You can take it all apart, get some 500 grit sand paper and clean everything up some. It might help the bike for the little longer, but if the rings are bad there really isn't any tricks to do.

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:12 pm

Wow. This ought to be fun! But hey, if I dont try now i'll never learn!

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:32 pm

check this out before tearing apart your top end...

http://hondaspree.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=1923
What "MySpree" dont tell you is thats not a honda motor, its a yamaha motor, but all the steps are the same and all the parts look about the same. So looking over that will give you some general knowledge before you dig into your motor.

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 7:44 pm

Now THAT will make things a lot easier!

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:36 pm

So just out of curiosity, I did the oil trick you mentioned, and it worked. But here's the thing, its been a couple hours now and im still getting the same result, without adding the oil to the cylinder.

It will fire up, run good for about 4 seconds and then die. It wont sputter, it just quits suddenly.

Still the top end? Could it be something else?

Dac · Post by **Dac** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:40 pm

i dont know, the oil trick normally helps it start, and from there you can run it till the oil burns off.

Can you get it to rev at all? or does it just die right away?
when it does start up, what color is the smoke?

scooternewby · Post by **scooternewby** » Mon Nov 03, 2008 8:50 pm

Dac wrote:i dont know, the oil trick normally helps it start, and from there you can run it till the oil burns off.

Can you get it to rev at all? or does it just die right away?
when it does start up, what color is the smoke?

The smoke was blue. And I can rev it so high I almost ran it off my patio!

What do you think?