2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Does your Spree/Elite already run great, and you're trying to make it quicker/faster? Need a monster motor swap? Discuss your ideas here.

Moderator: Moderator

User avatar
W8kbrder
Goped
Goped
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:54 pm

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by W8kbrder »

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

The S (restricted) pump is a different part number and its output relative to the SR version is not known. However that S model did not come with a cable control, likely because the demands of a Rev-limited engine didn't require it. I wouldn't worry that any damage has been incurred so far, because all is as Honda-san ordained.

If you de-restrict to make it more like an SR, I suggest you consider conversion to the SR-spec pump and cable control. The other option is to plug the pump socket and run premix.
Ok this explains why it runs like there is a govenor on it. It only tops out at 20mp on flat land. I got it up and running...cranks perfect, runs perfect. Its just not very fast. It averages 20mph on flat land....sometimes 19mph.

So if it is rev limited, what are the means of going about getting its stock power potential back. Also if I end up doing 9:1 gears, variator and roller pack, what issues do I need to take care of first regarding this oil pump with no wire deal?

I guess I'm going to have to solve the non-cable issue first and figure out what I can do to remove the "rev limiter" and what all is involved in that process. Any tips will be appreciated.
2001 Honda Elite S (De-restricted)
|Prodigy Variator w/ 9g weights|De-restricted Exhaust|Oil Pump Delete|1.5k Center Clutch Spring|2k Clutch Grabbers|.88 Main Jet|2nd Airbox Tab Removed|9:1 gears|49mph GPS confirmed|
User avatar
Wheelman-111
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 11325
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas

Shoestring Budget Elite

Post by Wheelman-111 »

Greetings:

The S model is restricted directly and indirectly by:

1. A washer welded into the exhaust headpipe limits the RPM by preventing full-bore flow through the exhaust.

2. A restrictor plate prevents the variator from going past about 1/2 of its available travel.

3. The main jet specified is a #68, compared to a #78 (Which is still pretty lean...) for the unrestricted SR model.

Don't run you de-restricted S until you score a 78 or better still an 82 or 85 main jet. (Honda can get them 99101-187-0850 Underscore is jet size)
With the right jet and stock variator and open exhaust header you should achieve nearly double your current top speed.

Adding an aftermarket variator will allow 42 MPH or better. Adding 9:1 gears to all the above yields about 48 in my direct experience.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
User avatar
W8kbrder
Goped
Goped
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:54 pm

Re: Shoestring Budget Elite

Post by W8kbrder »

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

The S model is restricted directly and indirectly by:

1. A washer welded into the exhaust headpipe limits the RPM by preventing full-bore flow through the exhaust.

2. A restrictor plate prevents the variator from going past about 1/2 of its available travel.

3. The main jet specified is a #68, compared to a #78 (Which is still pretty lean...) for the unrestricted SR model.

Don't run you de-restricted S until you score a 78 or better still an 82 or 85 main jet. (Honda can get them 99101-187-0850 Underscore is jet size)
With the right jet and stock variator and open exhaust header you should achieve nearly double your current top speed.

Adding an aftermarket variator will allow 42 MPH or better. Adding 9:1 gears to all the above yields about 48 in my direct experience.
Thank You Wheelman! I will be performing those modifications to get it to its stock potential.

What should I do in regards to the missing cable that attaches to the spring operated valve (oil pump)? I'm not even sure where that cable runs, but if I'm performing the previously stated modifications, I'm sure that oil pump valve will need to be operational?
2001 Honda Elite S (De-restricted)
|Prodigy Variator w/ 9g weights|De-restricted Exhaust|Oil Pump Delete|1.5k Center Clutch Spring|2k Clutch Grabbers|.88 Main Jet|2nd Airbox Tab Removed|9:1 gears|49mph GPS confirmed|
User avatar
odinxxix
CB900F
CB900F
Posts: 1640
Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 1:09 pm
Location: lafayette,Indiana

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by odinxxix »

just to confirm what wheelman says, i did all of those mods to my elite s and around 48 is what im getting, 85 jet,prodigy variator,7.7 gram rollers(get 7.5 if you can),9:1 gears,opened the other hole in the stock air box,replace belt. and 2k grabber springs in the clutch. 45/48 is what i suspect im getting but not gps'd but the needle stops moving at the U in fuel. but real d*** close to the e in fuel.
1986 honda spree(silver fox)
BBK
85 head
SB50 intake
SB50 reeds
taz gears
2.75X10 tires
2000 honda elite S
prodigy vari
2k grabber clutch springs
9:1 gears
jdm tail lite
1982 suzuki FA50
User avatar
W8kbrder
Goped
Goped
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:54 pm

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by W8kbrder »

So here is my main concern:

Before I do any of the previously stated modifictions, I need to state that my Elite S is the restricted version...meaning the variator has a restrictor plate, the exhaust has a restrictor bolt reducing airflow, the carb has a smaller jet, and there is NO cable attaching to the spring controlled flap on the oil pump.

If I go inside, and remove the restrictor plate on the variator and remove the block in the exhaust that is restricting airflow, as well as change out the small jet in the carb with a normal stock jet, what do I need to do about the cableless oil pump valve circled in red in the picture I posted? Currently my Elite does not have that cable because it is the toned-down restricted version of the normal Elite. I need to know where they cable goes....from the oil pump to where? What causes it to open/close? Is this cable going from the oil pump somehow tied in with the throttle cable?
2001 Honda Elite S (De-restricted)
|Prodigy Variator w/ 9g weights|De-restricted Exhaust|Oil Pump Delete|1.5k Center Clutch Spring|2k Clutch Grabbers|.88 Main Jet|2nd Airbox Tab Removed|9:1 gears|49mph GPS confirmed|
User avatar
Wheelman-111
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 11325
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by Wheelman-111 »

Greetings:

The SRs and pretty much all the Aeros except the '85s (Dunno about '83-'84...) have a throttle cable that features a cylindrical device that "splits" the cable's business end into 2. An illustration may be found in parts fiches online.

Your oil pump has a rotating, spring-loaded "throttle" on it too. It's default position is the lowest rate of oil delivery. You'd probably be OK just turning it all the way CCW and Zip-Tying it in that position. Your scooter may smoke a little more at idle, but it should receive enough oil at WOT. The split cables can be found on eBay, and perhaps Tazland has a few remaining.
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
User avatar
W8kbrder
Goped
Goped
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:54 pm

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by W8kbrder »

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

The SRs and pretty much all the Aeros except the '85s (Dunno about '83-'84...) have a throttle cable that features a cylindrical device that "splits" the cable's business end into 2. An illustration may be found in parts fiches online.

Your oil pump has a rotating, spring-loaded "throttle" on it too. It's default position is the lowest rate of oil delivery. You'd probably be OK just turning it all the way CCW and Zip-Tying it in that position. Your scooter may smoke a little more at idle, but it should receive enough oil at WOT. The split cables can be found on eBay, and perhaps Tazland has a few remaining.
Wow. I love this forum. You guys are great. Excellent information and I appreciate it. I will be documenting the mods with lots of pictures and detail.

:thumbwink:
2001 Honda Elite S (De-restricted)
|Prodigy Variator w/ 9g weights|De-restricted Exhaust|Oil Pump Delete|1.5k Center Clutch Spring|2k Clutch Grabbers|.88 Main Jet|2nd Airbox Tab Removed|9:1 gears|49mph GPS confirmed|
User avatar
W8kbrder
Goped
Goped
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:54 pm

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by W8kbrder »

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

The SRs and pretty much all the Aeros except the '85s (Dunno about '83-'84...) have a throttle cable that features a cylindrical device that "splits" the cable's business end into 2. An illustration may be found in parts fiches online.

Your oil pump has a rotating, spring-loaded "throttle" on it too. It's default position is the lowest rate of oil delivery. You'd probably be OK just turning it all the way CCW and Zip-Tying it in that position. Your scooter may smoke a little more at idle, but it should receive enough oil at WOT. The split cables can be found on eBay, and perhaps Tazland has a few remaining.
If I'm trying to buy the throttle cable that features the "cylindrical device that splits the cable's business" ....is there a particular part number for this?
2001 Honda Elite S (De-restricted)
|Prodigy Variator w/ 9g weights|De-restricted Exhaust|Oil Pump Delete|1.5k Center Clutch Spring|2k Clutch Grabbers|.88 Main Jet|2nd Airbox Tab Removed|9:1 gears|49mph GPS confirmed|
Flea_Biskit
Spree
Spree
Posts: 139
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2009 7:50 pm

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by Flea_Biskit »

man i had to go back and check but i could of sworn that wheelman told him twice how to unrestrict his elite :blah:
Ride it like you stole it'
User avatar
W8kbrder
Goped
Goped
Posts: 93
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:54 pm

Re: Shoestring Budget Elite

Post by W8kbrder »

Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

The S model is restricted directly and indirectly by:

1. A washer welded into the exhaust headpipe limits the RPM by preventing full-bore flow through the exhaust.

2. A restrictor plate prevents the variator from going past about 1/2 of its available travel.

3. The main jet specified is a #68, compared to a #78 (Which is still pretty lean...) for the unrestricted SR model.

Don't run you de-restricted S until you score a 78 or better still an 82 or 85 main jet. (Honda can get them 99101-187-0850 Underscore is jet size)
With the right jet and stock variator and open exhaust header you should achieve nearly double your current top speed.

Adding an aftermarket variator will allow 42 MPH or better. Adding 9:1 gears to all the above yields about 48 in my direct experience.
Questions for Wheelman or anyone else regarding the above 3 questions:

1.) Drilling out the welded washer in the exhaust headpipe should be no problem

2.) Does anyone have a picture or diagram of the restrictor plate "preventing the variator from going past 1/2 of its availiable travel". I need to know what needs to come apart to get to this.

3.) Who sells the #78 jet for the carb and how much does it run?
2001 Honda Elite S (De-restricted)
|Prodigy Variator w/ 9g weights|De-restricted Exhaust|Oil Pump Delete|1.5k Center Clutch Spring|2k Clutch Grabbers|.88 Main Jet|2nd Airbox Tab Removed|9:1 gears|49mph GPS confirmed|
User avatar
Wheelman-111
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 11325
Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2008 5:09 pm
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by Wheelman-111 »

Greetings:

2. Check the Service Manual section. Remove the variator. You should see 3 small bolts - 7mm hex heads. A thin-walled box-end wrench or socket is needed to remove them. The flat circular plate behind them can be discarded, along with the bolts.

3. Read this number to your dealer's Parts Dude: 99101-187-0780. They run about $5.00, or about 42MPH. :) The last 4 digits represent the size. You might want to order an -0820 and an 0880 while you're at it, in case you decide to fool with the airbox.

Good luck!
Wheelman-111
Most of my money is spent on scooterparts. The rest is just wasted.
"ISO": '03 Vespa ET4 Malossi187 74MPH
Flash 9: 2001 Elite SR Contesta 72 ZX Tran, 9:1 Gears, Stock Airbox/Carb/Pipe 58.8 MPH
Punkin: 2010 Vespa/Malossi S78, 61MPH
Elite50USD
BMX
BMX
Posts: 26
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 4:04 pm

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by Elite50USD »

W8kbrder wrote:
Wheelman-111 wrote:Greetings:

The SRs and pretty much all the Aeros except the '85s (Dunno about '83-'84...) have a throttle cable that features a cylindrical device that "splits" the cable's business end into 2. An illustration may be found in parts fiches online.

Your oil pump has a rotating, spring-loaded "throttle" on it too. It's default position is the lowest rate of oil delivery. You'd probably be OK just turning it all the way CCW and Zip-Tying it in that position. Your scooter may smoke a little more at idle, but it should receive enough oil at WOT. The split cables can be found on eBay, and perhaps Tazland has a few remaining.
If I'm trying to buy the throttle cable that features the "cylindrical device that splits the cable's business" ....is there a particular part number for this?
This is the part number for the Elite SR (the de-resticted at stock version) throttle cable. It has a split at the end for the oil pump!

SKU: 17920-GS7-325
Trinity1
Noob
Noob
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:50 pm
Location: charleston, sc

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by Trinity1 »

Hey Guys

Trying to do the same type of restricitons on my 2001 Honda Elite S 50

I tried going to the cite listed below by ODIN for the variator parts....but I can't seem to find them on that page

"http://scootspecs.wordpress.com/
go here for the variator and maybe a set of 9:1 gears. 92.00 shipped. maybe a set of grabber springs"

I am an Old Man in need of some help~~~~~and a combat Vet~~~ can someone PLEASe help me out here!
User avatar
evilone
Board Supporter
Board Supporter
Posts: 3205
Joined: Sun May 18, 2008 7:26 pm
Location: Portage Michigan

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by evilone »

Trinity1 wrote:I tried going to the cite listed below by ODIN for the variator parts....but I can't seem to find them on that page

"http://scootspecs.wordpress.com/
go here for the variator and maybe a set of 9:1 gears. 92.00 shipped. maybe a set of grabber springs"

I am an Old Man in need of some help~~~~~and a combat Vet~~~ can someone PLEASe help me out here!
That site was up and running at the time Odin posted it. Since then Yan (site owner) has gotten out of the scooter scene. No more parts that i know of.
2001 Honda Elite
1995 Yamaha Jog
1994 Yamaha Axis

I can't believe
that cop put me
in the backseat
when I clearly
called shotgun.
User avatar
Trafficjamz
CBR1000RR
CBR1000RR
Posts: 5353
Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2009 7:53 pm
Location: Eastlake, MI
Contact:

Re: 2001 Elite S 50 - Budget Entry Level Mods?

Post by Trafficjamz »

you can get gears on ebay.

are you looking for 9:1's
new best 1/8th mile time 9.647 seconds @67.155 mph 310lbs total weight
Post Reply