UK Honda Vision NE50 MF - newbie performance advice sought

[nobbylad]

Here's my engine. 4 x bolts holding barrel onto the casing, 2 x bolts for the exhaust manifold



Engine number



Frame number



I have lots of cleaning to do!





I've been recommended the following upgrades:-

http://www.racing-planet.co.uk/cylinder ... hNjapLq3G4

http://www.racing-planet.co.uk/variator ... hNjh5Lq3G4

And this pipe => http://www.ve-supermarket.co.uk/search_ ... ind.y=-327

[swimmingfree]

well i think you have a spree motor you have 2 bolts that hold the manifold to the block (see photo ) so you have a no variator and less speed and thing you can do to it.... pull the cover that the kick starter is no and take some photo of the variator if you have one...
swimmingfree

[nobbylad]

There's definitely a variator in there, as it's identical to my previous scoot. I'll pull it apart and post some pics. Thanks

[swimmingfree]

were the i have the arrow pointing its looks to be 2 bolts and if the motor has a variator i think its what i think a pail motor and we dont have them over here ... so i wood be no help ...sorry
swimmingfree

[Kevinstonge]

I think there is still some confusion in the air......But there is HOPE!!
I believe your vision in an 85, in which case you still have the variated af05e engine, it just still has the old style intake manifold similar to a spree. Removing your belt cover and finding the variator as the drive pulley will 100% confirm this.

So assuming you have the 85 2 bolt variated af05e, you have a decent amount of options for bolt ons.
-Contact red eft when u can and get the malossi bore ordered!
-The variator should be upgraded as well, but look into a honda ruckus variator swap to save a couple bucks.
- If you want to keep the stock 1.5" rear wheel, consider a 2.75 or 3x10. If your mind is set on 90/90, find a honda metro rear wheel. Bolts right on to your af05, and you can run them tubeless.
-the sp3 exhaust does seem to be the only one available here in the states. Yahoo auctions Japan has rare exhausts for visions but I can't use the site if my life depended on it.

These mods should get you cruising up to 40-45. To get to 50 consistently might take a little extra work. (Ex. Carb work, variator roller weight tuning, gears)

[noiseguy]

well i think you have a spree motor you have 2 bolts that hold the manifold to the block (see photo ) so you have a no variator and less speed and thing you can do to it.... pull the cover that the kick starter is no and take some photo of the variator if you have one...
swimmingfree

SF, you're the one that's confused. This is a UK poster and UK block. It doesn't look like the US versions.

But I thought the same thing. That looks like a Spree intake.

I don't know where you can get Malossi parts in UK, but Red Eft does sell them from stateside.

The US version of the AF05 block... gears aren't available but can be installed from an AF16 kit if you have access to a machine shop (the parts need lathed and pressed. Not hard with a machine shop, but not a bolt up either.) Brand of gear, for this option, is less important that getting the right gear bits (the "upgrade" can be done in a couple different ways with the 3 gears that are in the gear case.)

I'd concentrate on getting it running right, stock, then go from there with upgrade parts.

I like the Kelli ramp plate for the AF05 as a cheap/easy upgrade for stock. I believe the Ruckus variator will fit if you grind the case out (I know it fits AF16... not sure on your engine.)

[swimmingfree]

why i think its a pail motor is ...
photo 1 ex port looks like a spree not a se50 wrong angle.. the fan shrow looks to be hafe metal hafe plastic..
photo 3 the first number is af09 ??? not af05..
photo 5 two bolt manifold not 4...
but i have been wrong before and will be wrong again ...
swimmingfree

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

I'm betting it's the variated block. Note the angled exhaust port and the kicker cover. If the kickstart pedal swings backwards, it's the SE/05. The 1985 U.S. Version used the two-bolt, Spree-ish intake. That design probably was sold in other markets in different years as well.

[paulpauly7]

its definitly not a pal motor .I have a pal motor on the bench in front of me

[nobbylad]

Hi guys, I'm really grateful for your input and apologies for the confusion!

Here's some pics to help clear a few things up. I knew it was variated as I bought 2 x together as non-runners and they were both the same. The log book for this scoot gives date of registration as April 1988, but it could be a 1987 engine.




Barrel and piston (coked up but barrel is not scored)





I also found some spares knocking around, a spare barrel (scored - needs reboring so thinking of seeing if the local shop can bore it out to 46/47mm and supply an oversize piston - they specialise in 2xstroke stuff so this could be an option), rollers - not sure what weight, a spare variator and spare head.



I've found a dealer in the UK that will do the Malossi cylinder kit for a price that works out at $136.95 (incl. shipping), however they are adamant that you re-use the cylinder head as they say Malossi don't supply one for this kit, which seems to contradict RED EFT's kit - I'd expect you'd need to swap the head too?

[Red Eft Performance]

The US version of the AF05 block... gears aren't available but can be installed from an AF16 kit if you have access to a machine shop (the parts need lathed and pressed. Not hard with a machine shop, but not a bolt up either.) Brand of gear, for this option, is less important that getting the right gear bits (the "upgrade" can be done in a couple different ways with the 3 gears that are in the gear case.)

Just a heads up Malossi makes gears for the afo5 I always have them In stock.
Keith

[nobbylad]

The US version of the AF05 block... gears aren't available but can be installed from an AF16 kit if you have access to a machine shop (the parts need lathed and pressed. Not hard with a machine shop, but not a bolt up either.) Brand of gear, for this option, is less important that getting the right gear bits (the "upgrade" can be done in a couple different ways with the 3 gears that are in the gear case.)

Just a heads up Malossi makes gears for the afo5 I always have them In stock.
Keith

Thanks Keith - is that the same as these?

http://www.piaggiospares.co.uk/spares/p ... tAodbyoAUw

[Red Eft Performance]

The US version of the AF05 block... gears aren't available but can be installed from an AF16 kit if you have access to a machine shop (the parts need lathed and pressed. Not hard with a machine shop, but not a bolt up either.) Brand of gear, for this option, is less important that getting the right gear bits (the "upgrade" can be done in a couple different ways with the 3 gears that are in the gear case.)

Just a heads up Malossi makes gears for the afo5 I always have them In stock.
Keith

Thanks Keith - is that the same as these?

http://www.piaggiospares.co.uk/spares/p ... tAodbyoAUw

Yes

[WeeMan]

Hi,

I have been re building my UK 85 Vision for about 12 months and its just about done. The guys on here are really good and its because of them I never gave up. I have / had the same engine as you. I swopped the head barrel and cylinder for malossi ones. I added the malossi multivar variator. I then added the Leo Vince SP3 pipe which made a big difference after I de restricted it. I then added a 19mm delorto carb because I really struggled to tune the Keihin carb which is standard. I finally added a trail tech vapor to help with the temps and revs and its now all back together. Running it in but it runs really well. Be careful with those malossi gears as I thing they are about 7.5 to 1 which I have been told is really tall. This gives a better top end but its really slow up to about 10mph. To help I used Malossi.com for most of the kit and Sip-scootershop.com for the pipe.

I am in the UK as well so if you close I could always give you a hand or at least send you some help via email.

Good Luck.

Danny

[Wheelman-111]

Greetings:

Malossi primaries are 16/32 for a final drive ratio of 7.83:1. Absolutely sucks from 0 to clutch engagement - around 6-7 MPH. After that, variator keeps things happy, including hills. (As long as you don't stop in the middle...) Top speeds approaching 60 are possible if the power is there to do it.