Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Does your Spree/Elite already run great, and you're trying to make it quicker/faster? Need a monster motor swap? Discuss your ideas here.

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spreeinkc
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Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by spreeinkc »

Hello, been lurking on the forum for a while but don't post much. I've been rebuilding spree's, Aero's, and Elite's on the side for a while now but haven't gotten into modifying them. I've been thinking about keeping a couple for my self and would like to make them a little faster. I've got several 86' aero's, 87' se50p, 93' sa50p, and 98' elite that some asshat removed the sticker on so I don't know the model number. I assume the 98' is the best to modify from what I've gathered on here but I'm not sure if there is a definite second best or are the others all the same?

All the Aero's run within a couple mph of each other and the 93' sa50p has the same exhaust and variator as the Aero's and it runs the same as them. The 87' se50p (which I knew nothing about till I picked this one up and realized it was different than the other elite's I've came across) was still stock. I swapped the variator and exhaust from a 86' Aero and this thing by far is the fastest one. I just picked up the 98' Elite b/c of what I've read on here about the engine's. It is a little faster than the aero's and 93' elite but not the se50. I even bought a cheap aftermarket variator off ebay, originally for the Aero but didn't make much difference. Also tried it on the 93' with no noticeable difference so threw it on the 98' and it did help on the top end but surprisingly the se50 is still a little faster on accell and top end. So I guess my question is am I missing something? Is there something that makes the se50 faster or better or does that one just happen to run really good? (I've got 4 Aero's all 86' plus the two other elites which all run about the same with the newest elite being a little e faster than the others)

I've also played around with different weights on all of them and they all run the best with the stock weights. Even the aftermarket variator I had to put in the stock heavier weights instead of the lighter ones it came with. I assume that's b/c they're all still stock with the exception of the one variator?

I like how peppy the se50 is but hate the seat, suspension, and lack of storage and don't really want to get into swapping a bunch of suspension stuff unless I can swap it from a scooter I already have. Once I decide which two I'm keeping I plan on modifying them but not sure what to get yet. One of them I would like to go pretty extreme with and the other just a little more power. I'd like to be able to go 45-50 uphill so I can keep up with traffic but still be reliable. Any input would be appreciated.

I will try and add some pictures once I figure out how to make them smaller...

PS~ Is there a way to tell what model the 98' elite is from the vin# or is there just one so it doesn't matter?
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by bfowler »

I get a little confused myself with the engine differences between the different models but I'm pretty sure the engines in your 86' and 87' aeros are basically the same as the engine in the 87' se50p as well as the 93' sa50p.

As far as which scooter to upgrade, the af16 engine which is in the 98' elite is by far the best engine to upgrade. There are so many aftermarket parts for that engine and your goal of 45-50 is easily attainable. The 98' elites came in 2 different models, one being the restricted version and the other being the unrestricted version. Your VIN will tell you which version you have. If your VIN begins with 3H1AF160 then you lucked out and have the unrestricted version. If your VIN begins with 3H1AF161 then you have the restricted version. Let us know what version you have so we can go from there. If you have the restricted version then were gonna start by derestricting and if you have the unrestricted version we need to figure out why it is going slower than the 87' elite and then get it running in tip top shape. I'm assuming you have the restricted version though.

For which second scooter to upgrade, its more of a personal preference for you. The 87' elite se50 was only sold in America for 1 year so it makes it a little rare but a lot of people seem to like the look of Aeros more. Aeros also have a little more storage space with the glove box. Others will chime in with more info!
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spreeinkc
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by spreeinkc »

Sweet. the 98' is not the restricted version. And to clarify it is faster than the 93' and the aero's but not by much. The 87' sp50e was restricted when I got it and I swapped the variator and exhaust. I also swapped jets with one from an aero but don't know if its the right size as they're not marked. It didn't seem to make much difference and does kind of cut out on low rpm's like when taking off from a stop. just does it for a second then takes off but does it almost every time. surprisingly though it is still the fastest out of all of them.

Took some pics so lets see if they load this time.

Still not but im on my phone. I'll go inside and try it.
Last edited by spreeinkc on Thu Oct 03, 2013 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by bfowler »

Upload them onto photobucket and then copy the image code here. Makes it a lot easier to upload images
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by spreeinkc »

Think I figured it out...

98' Elite
IMG_20131003_142431.jpg
IMG_20131003_142431.jpg (169.85 KiB) Viewed 4071 times
93' Elite
IMG_20131003_143115.jpg
IMG_20131003_143115.jpg (216.64 KiB) Viewed 4071 times
87' SE50
87' SP50
87' SP50
IMG_20131003_143100.jpg (222.04 KiB) Viewed 4071 times
Apparently 3 is max
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spreeinkc
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by spreeinkc »

86' Aero
IMG_20131003_143044.jpg
IMG_20131003_143044.jpg (188.61 KiB) Viewed 4070 times
Here's other side of the garage...
IMG_20130924_201412.jpg
IMG_20130924_201412.jpg (98.21 KiB) Viewed 4070 times
IMG_20130924_202109.jpg
IMG_20130924_202109.jpg (103.28 KiB) Viewed 4070 times
Plus more boxes of parts and more scooters out back...
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donut
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by donut »

wow beautiful aero
'86 Aero 50 (NB50)

'01 Yamaha Jog Nextzone
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by paulpauly7 »

i see you have a fully developed case of scooterism:-):-)
86 Nifty Fifty (spree)
ZX disk brake
Kitico 120kmh speedo
AF18 ZX ported
Polini corsa
Malossi crank
CTmani
24mmOKO
40pilot118main
Scorpion pipe
8.44 to 1
Michelin s1
71.3mph
92 yz125, 94 crm250
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spreeinkc
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by spreeinkc »

Yeah a little. The spree's sell like hot cakes here. During the summer everyone I posted sold within 24hrs. Unfortunately starting to slow down now.
donut wrote:wow beautiful aero
Thanks. I like the white ones... Broke down and sold one yesterday but I have a couple left. (you can see my favorite in the top right corner)
IMG_20130728_2201461.jpg
IMG_20130728_2201461.jpg (92.53 KiB) Viewed 4053 times
This one isn't as nice. Plastic is jacked, turn signals are broken, and I have a trailer light as a brake light but it works good. lol
IMG_20130606_153921.jpg
IMG_20130606_153921.jpg (157.81 KiB) Viewed 4053 times
My favorite

Image
eliteguy50
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by eliteguy50 »

Very nice collection. The porting on the '87 cylinder is better than the '86. The '87 to 98 difference could be rollers , belt wear, exhaust build up, compression, carb tune...
motormike wrote:Errands become adventures.
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by kingearwig »

yeah if you want one to go 45-50 just get yourself a ct manifold and a carb for the 98 and a v8 exhaust(~$200 for all that). Port the exhaust on the cylinder a bit, use a VW exhaust gasket, then lighten the variator weights(from 8 to 7.5).

or you could just get the 8:1 gears for it but you will lose a little pep. this is the cheaper option but if you get the carb and exhaust first you will like it more and be more likely to get gears and BBK later and then it will easily do 60mph.
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by maddog »

Make a fair offer on that white/blue aero and i will buy it, Pm me.
some people dream of speed, i own your dreams!
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by Drifter562 »

spreeinkc wrote:Hello, been lurking on the forum for a while but don't post much. I've been rebuilding spree's, Aero's, and Elite's on the side for a while now but haven't gotten into modifying them. I've been thinking about keeping a couple for my self and would like to make them a little faster. I've got several 86' aero's, 87' se50p, 93' sa50p, and 98' elite that some asshat removed the sticker on so I don't know the model number. I assume the 98' is the best to modify from what I've gathered on here but I'm not sure if there is a definite second best or are the others all the same?

All the Aero's run within a couple mph of each other and the 93' sa50p has the same exhaust and variator as the Aero's and it runs the same as them. The 87' se50p (which I knew nothing about till I picked this one up and realized it was different than the other elite's I've came across) was still stock. I swapped the variator and exhaust from a 86' Aero and this thing by far is the fastest one. I just picked up the 98' Elite b/c of what I've read on here about the engine's. It is a little faster than the aero's and 93' elite but not the se50. I even bought a cheap aftermarket variator off ebay, originally for the Aero but didn't make much difference. Also tried it on the 93' with no noticeable difference so threw it on the 98' and it did help on the top end but surprisingly the se50 is still a little faster on accell and top end. So I guess my question is am I missing something? Is there something that makes the se50 faster or better or does that one just happen to run really good? (I've got 4 Aero's all 86' plus the two other elites which all run about the same with the newest elite being a little e faster than the others)

I've also played around with different weights on all of them and they all run the best with the stock weights. Even the aftermarket variator I had to put in the stock heavier weights instead of the lighter ones it came with. I assume that's b/c they're all still stock with the exception of the one variator?

I like how peppy the se50 is but hate the seat, suspension, and lack of storage and don't really want to get into swapping a bunch of suspension stuff unless I can swap it from a scooter I already have. Once I decide which two I'm keeping I plan on modifying them but not sure what to get yet. One of them I would like to go pretty extreme with and the other just a little more power. I'd like to be able to go 45-50 uphill so I can keep up with traffic but still be reliable. Any input would be appreciated.

I will try and add some pictures once I figure out how to make them smaller...

PS~ Is there a way to tell what model the 98' elite is from the vin# or is there just one so it doesn't matter?
I seen out the corner of one of the pics that you might possibly have spare engines are any for sale and if so what are the models? thanks bro
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by spreeinkc »

eliteguy50 wrote:Very nice collection. The porting on the '87 cylinder is better than the '86. The '87 to 98 difference could be rollers , belt wear, exhaust build up, compression, carb tune...
Well it turns out the 87 and 98 are about the same with the 87 having a 1-2 mph higher top end if going down a very steep hill. I was just comparing them earlier based off of when me and my gf's son (who is 15 and 65lbs lighter than me) would go out riding them. Turns out which ever one I'm on is always the slower one. :oops: I downloaded a speedometer app on my phone and did some testing between the two and the numbers are pretty close. The hit 42-43 mph with a very slight down hill slope and 47-49 mph down the steepest hill by my house. Going up the same steep hill 28-30 mph. I haven't checked the Aero or the 93 yet but plan on doing more testing.

@kingearwig Thanks for the tips. I assume ct is the brand? Any suggestions where the best place to buy the manifold and carb? What's the purpose/benefit for using a VW exhaust gasket and where would I pick one of those up at? I planned on eventually porting it but didn't know if it would make a difference with it being stock so hadn't mess with it yet. I saw a post somewhere about porting and had pictures and stuff showing how.

Also I thought I saw a post showing all of the gear ratio's for all the different years and models but I cant find it now. Anyone happen to remember what section it was in?

@maddog Only reason I sold one last week is b/c a guy came to look at a Spree and I made the mistake of letting him ride an Aero prior to trying to make the sale on the Spree and of course he didn't want the Spree anymore. Offered me 700 for one of the cleaner ones so I couldn't really say no.
The only Aero I'd sell now would be the one with the red seat. (which I have a extra blue one I could swap it with now) Unfortunately I stripped the fork tube on it and another one trying to tighten them down b/c the steering had play in it. I've done it to three of them now and it's really * me off b/c I don't have a welder to fix them. I should of known something was up when I had to grind some spot welds off of the nut on one of them. I borrowed one of those cheap little Harbor Freight mig welders from a buddy but it didn't work, wouldn't stick. I break enough stuff I really wish I knew how to weld.

@Drifter562 Yeah I have stacks of spree engines but not any that currently work. They either need rings, bearings, case is broken, crank is stripped, or the piston is rusted to the cylinder so bad that they have become one solid piece of rusty crap. I have a shed full of frames that those came off of. Unfortunately I have more spree's than I do usable engines at the moment.
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Re: Which two should I modify? (nb50, se50, sa50, xx50...?)

Post by kingearwig »

spreeinkc wrote:@kingearwig Thanks for the tips. I assume ct is the brand? Any suggestions where the best place to buy the manifold and carb? What's the purpose/benefit for using a VW exhaust gasket and where would I pick one of those up at? I planned on eventually porting it but didn't know if it would make a difference with it being stock so hadn't mess with it yet. I saw a post somewhere about porting and had pictures and stuff showing how.
https://www.treatland.tv/OKO-24mm-carbu ... -metal.htm There is a carb for you... you will have to get a jet kit for it unless you know a dirt bike guy with a bucketfull of them like I do.

The manifold I would get from ebay...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Performance-Man ... ac&vxp=mtr


Have you looked at the stock exhaust gasket? Well it goes inside of the exhaust port on the jug... its outside diameter is the size of the inside diameter of the the VW gasket(available at autozone... vw beatle exhaust manifold gasket). The vw gasket goes on the exhaust studs. It allows you to open up the exhaust port to a much greater size. Plus the stock exhaust gasket will not work with the v8 pipe.http://www.ebay.com/itm/Custom-handmade ... 4e&vxp=mtr
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